March 18, 2026

You Can Be Strong… and Still Break | Mental Survivability for Cops & Vets

You Can Be Strong… and Still Break | Mental Survivability for Cops & Vets

Shoot me a message! We talk with therapist Becky DeStefano about mental survivability and why mental readiness is tactical readiness for police, first responders, and military veterans. We break down stigma, trauma, proactive wellness checks, and how real strength looks like honesty and vulnerability under the uniform. • Becky’s path from civilian supporter to emergency responder and military psychology clinician • Blue Love and the value of visible community support • The ...

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Shoot me a message!

We talk with therapist Becky DeStefano about mental survivability and why mental readiness is tactical readiness for police, first responders, and military veterans. We break down stigma, trauma, proactive wellness checks, and how real strength looks like honesty and vulnerability under the uniform. 

• Becky’s path from civilian supporter to emergency responder and military psychology clinician 
• Blue Love and the value of visible community support 
• The morale hit of public judgment and how it compounds stress 
• What “holding space” means in practical counseling terms 
• How trust is earned with first responders and veterans 
• Common therapy misconceptions including fear of judgment and labels 
• Barriers to treatment including stigma and men’s mental health pressure 
• Why PTSD and police suicide research still feels new 
• What proactive police wellness checks look like day to day 
• Why suicide risk is not always obvious and why check-ins matter 
• The neurobiology of trauma including adrenaline, hypervigilance, and recovery 
• Dark humor as a coping mechanism and when suppression becomes risky 
• Why Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and fitness build resilience and connection 
• The collateral damage of untreated trauma across sleep, health, and relationships 
• Strength as vulnerability and finding the right therapist fit 

If something in this conversation resonates with you, take the first step, reach out, have the conversation. Make sure you follow Becky on both those platforms at holding space for heroes on Instagram and Facebook. 


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Episode Powered By Act Now Education

00:00 - ental Survivability And The Mission

02:56 - hy A Civilian Serves The Uniform

06:46 - orale After Defund The Police

11:02 - ebranding Into Holding Space For Heroes

13:43 - ow Trust Gets Earned In Therapy

21:51 - tigma Barriers And Men’s Mental Health

25:17 - he Moment She Went Back To School

28:01 - hy PTSD Research Still Feels New

31:07 - nside A Police Clinician Role

33:22 - roactive Wellness Checks Versus Crisis Care

37:28 - hat Trauma Does To The Body

43:14 - arning Signs And The Truth About Humor

49:36 - hy Jiu Jitsu Builds Resilience

57:23 - he Cost Of Untreated Trauma

01:02:26 - edefining Strength As Vulnerability

01:07:05 - here To Find Becky

01:07:57 - ental Readiness Is Tactical Readiness

WEBVTT

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Warriors, fall in.

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It's time for formation.

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Today we're talking about a side of readiness that doesn't always get enough attention, mental survivability.

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My guest today is Becky DeStefano.

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She's a pre-licensed therapist specializing in first responders and military with a master's degree in emergency responder and military psychology.

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She practices in Rhode Island and Massachusetts with Foundations for Well for Wellness.

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Becky, I want to thank you for joining me on the Morning Formation today.

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Thank you so much for having me.

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I really appreciate it.

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I'm really interested in digging down and getting into uh mental health.

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A lot of times it's sort of a, in my opinion, it's kind of a thing that people just throw around, they talk about.

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But to actually talk to a professional is really refreshing for me because I know that you've got some tremendous insights having been involved with folks that have real mental health issues and also helping those folks resolve those issues as well.

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So thank you for being on the podcast today.

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Yeah, thank you for inviting me.

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I really appreciate it.

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I'm looking forward to it.

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So, Becky, what drew you towards supporting law enforcement and military mental health with you being a civilian?

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So in 2019, um, my best friend's brother was on the job uh here in Rhode Island where I live.

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Um, and we noticed the some of the mental health effects in general.

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We just kind of wanted to provide support for our local officers.

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And as we learned more about the need for mental health, we just sort of dove in and said, all right, let's provide support and mental health resources from a civilian standpoint.

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Uh, and it just kind of took off from there.

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Um, we created an organization that I've now been just running on my own for the past five or so years to provide this support and resources to let initially it was law enforcement, now it's all first responders and military, to let them know they're not alone and that there is support and that the community supports them, but also mentally there is uh professional help for those who may need it based on everything that they see on a daily basis.

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A lot of folks talk about military mental health, but I think the one thing that's not spoken about enough is first responders' mental health.

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And I guess maybe it's because first responders don't leave the environment until retirement.

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And then after retirement, that's when things sometimes can can become an internal problem.

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Um you kind of get in your own head.

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Yeah.

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Um in 2019, when you launched Blue Love, what problem were you trying to solve?

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Uh I think we were just trying to be visible at that point.

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It was just like, hey, there are people, and this is before everything, you know, popped off in 2020, right?

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So we just wanted people, we wanted our officers to understand that there were people out there who cared about them and saw them as people.

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Um and then obviously everything that happened after that and since then, uh, that support has been even more important just to just to connect and say, hey, you're not alone, or we see you, or we know you're a human being and not just a uniform.

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Um, and then, you know, as we got more into it and as I started kind of building the online community, I wanted to include all first responders in the military because those communities often connect, right?

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Like a lot of veterans go into responder roles.

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Uh, and there's a lot of um, you know, intertwined between those communities as well.

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So it made sense to provide those resources as we've gone along.

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And then uh I decided to go back to school to become the professional I was referring people to.

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So instead of being like, hey, you know, you can go see this person, I'm like, all right, I will just become that person.

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And for folks out there that that don't know, what what exactly was Blue Love all about?

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So Blue Love, we was sort of a civilian community organization.

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Uh, to we provided, so we did all the types of things, bringing food to stations, set up tables at events.

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Um, we even did some uh pro-law enforcement rallies when the defund was at its height uh and things like that.

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But then it was really about networking online uh and building a really solid online community, which is still going and growing to this day, to connect with officers, agencies, like-minded organizations, um, all responders, their families, supporters, um, all of us kind of coming together for this mission in various uh different levels and various different roles.

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Yeah.

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I love it when I hear about people pulling their efforts together and their superpowers together to try to make something happen and actually move the needle.

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You talked about uh during the height of the defund, I don't know what you want to call it, timeline in history, defund the police timeline in history.

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And I've actually gotten into it, people before about that, where people are like, well, technically that they didn't take any money away from you know this agency or that department or whatever.

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But here's the thing that people don't think about, and it's called morale.

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When you've got people on the news and you've got people in your own family sitting at the dinner table at the Thanksgiving uh dinner, and you've got friends and family that are sort of like on the cusp of also pieing into that, your morale goes into the trash can.

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So having those pro events kind of reinstitutes the idea that you're still doing an important job and you're still doing a thankless job, and you're still doing a job that people definitely appreciate.

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So thank you for being involved in those types of things because a lot of our uh men and women in blue uh needed to hear that from somewhere during that time.

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I've uh I'm a military veteran as well as a law enforcement officer as well.

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Um can tell you that hearing that is is a true appreciation for me.

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And when you were doing that project, what did you notice officers and first responders struggling with the most at times?

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Was it support, morale?

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What was it?

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It was I I think it was a little bit of of everything.

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And honestly, there were a lot of agencies that were defunded.

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And then when they found out, oh, when you call cops and they can't come because they don't have enough, now we need to refund and put money back in.

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You know, you had big cities who had hours, uh, empty windows of time where there were no cars.

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Like people were calling 911 for literally any violent crime, anything.

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And they're like, we don't have enough cars.

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So we really wanted to put our energy into support and just kind of like, hey, there are people who love you and there are people who support you.

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Um, you know, it was really, it was a very difficult time because you get heated, right?

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And you want to like go and defend them.

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And then, you know, I have a lot of cop friends who are like, you can't go down there, like you can't go down to these cities where these riots are happening to, you know, like it's you want to do a human chain, right?

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But you can't.

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You can't.

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They're like, you're gonna get hurt.

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You have, you know, like, so we're like, all right, where can we put our energy so that we can do something that's gonna actually help?

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Um, so it was just letting them know that they're not alone and that everybody feels this way.

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It's actually, you know, they're loud.

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This minority of people that um hate the police are are loud.

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So we had to be louder, but in a different way.

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So instead of just going on social media, which we did, we also went right to the officers and were like, hey, they're loud, but we're louder, and we're gonna do it in a different way that actually matters.

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And hopefully it did.

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And even if one officer felt something different than feeling attacked or feeling hated, then it was it was worth it.

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I'll tell you what sucked the most, and I and I felt it when I was in the military when we were at war, and I felt it again when I was in law enforcement, was what sucked the most for me was being judged by the guy who sells shoes for a living.

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And what I mean by that is you have people that literally have jobs that have nothing, have never experienced what it's like to walk a mile in a pair of boots, whether it be military or law enforcement or first responder boots, judging and telling me about what's going on and what it's like and what it smells like.

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And it's because of social media, it's because people flip on their social media all day long and they watch videos and they feel like, oh yeah, I know what that's like, a thousand percent.

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And it's not the same as being on the ground and smelling the earth uh when things are going down.

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So that's what really irritated me the most.

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And that's I talk about morale and things like that.

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That's why it was refreshing to when I ran across your social media today.

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I was like, yeah, this is a great cause, this is a great purpose.

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Now, when you rebranded to holding space for heroes, um, why did you do that?

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And what does that name represent?

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So, excuse me.

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So I rebranded two years ago because um I really wanted to include everybody.

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I felt like the need was there, and that was what I my degree is in.

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Um, so right from when I started my degree program, I was learning about police suicide.

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I was learning about very heavy issues that we needed to go right into from the get-go.

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Like I had professors who were retired cops and veterans and things like that.

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So I thought to myself, all right, what am I going to rename it?

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And holding space is um a phrase that's you know used in within mental health.

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And I think it's a very important phrase because it means that like you've got a spot.

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Instead of making space, I'm holding it.

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So you've got a spot.

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You don't have to worry that there's not enough room for you.

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Um, and then our first responders in our military are our heroes.

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So that's where that came from.

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Uh and then my logo was designed by a company called Modified Misfits, and they are actually um NYPD cops who do logo design on the side.

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So I try to support as many brands that are veteran-owned, cop-owned, with, you know, responder-owned as I can, um, and just get as much, as many resources out there as we can for everybody, and then connect with other organizations who do the same to just keep sharing these messages and keep letting people know that they're not alone.

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God bless you and your work.

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Now, what does hold what does holding space actually look like in practical terms for a police officer or a military veteran?

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It's basically just talk about whatever you want to talk about.

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You know, you the it's your space.

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So it's like you have your your space literally, right?

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Like if someone's coming to sit in my office, this is your time.

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You can do whatever you want.

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You can vent, you can tell me how great things are going, um, anything in between, you know, uh for clients and things like that.

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And right now, like I'm doing police wellness checks for my local department that I contracted with.

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Um, so when they come in, you know, I'm just kind of checking in and asking questions, making sure they're good.

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If you're good, great.

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And if you're not, we'll figure it out.

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This, but this is your time and your space, and I'm not going to tell you what you have to say or what this is.

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It's what you want to make of it.

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And that space holds for you.

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So it's not like you come in for one appointment and you're gone.

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That your space is yours.

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So anytime you want to come and fill that space because you need somebody, it's yours.

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It's held for you.

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It's impactful.

00:12:48.490 --> 00:12:58.410
And to get down to the heart of the matter, you know, you being a civilian entering the first responder culture and the military veteran culture, how do you how do you build that trust?

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You know, I I don't know how it happened, honestly.

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Um, I connect.

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I don't uh it's been something that has cons consistently happened organically.

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Um it is a very earned, not given situation where when I can talk to some of the most heroic people I've ever met who have done things I could never do, uh, are willing to sit with me and tell me their stories or share with me their their vulnerabilities, things like that.

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Um it's it's just a calling.

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I I that's really the only way I can describe it is it's my calling.

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And I think that people can pick up on that energy and trust me.

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And I know that if I can have someone in those communities trust me, then I'm doing something right.

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And it's a sacred um form of gratitude that that they do because, you know, you guys know, I mean, you're cut from a different cloth, and sometimes it's hard to get through.

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And that's that's okay.

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That's part of the job.

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Um, but I overall have a really good record of being able to connect.

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I I can't tell you that I understand firsthand what you've gone through.

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I can never say that.

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I tell all my cops that too.

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Like, I'm like, I can't tell you I firsthand understand.

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I've never served, I've never been a first responder.

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So I'm not gonna tell you that I get it in that way, but I do get it to a point so that I can at least connect and try to help you uh help yourself and heal.

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You know, I think the first step that is uh for us, it feels like you you have to talk to someone that has empathy, the willingness to listen, and some understanding.

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Because there's people that I've spoken to before, and when I try to explain to them what it's like to be in a war zone or what it's like to be in a combat zone, like there's times where like I can tell that the lights will shut off and that in their mind they already know, so you can't tell them anything.

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But when you're talking to someone that is open to listen and is willing to have that empathy to try to feel uh what it was like to be there, there's a huge difference.

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And I think it's has to do with more of the character of the person and where their heart really lies and and what they're doing.

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Um have you ever experienced moments of resistance and how have you handled that before?

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Yeah, with you mean with like clients that yeah, uh yeah, um yeah, I've dealt, you know, um it it goes away pretty quickly, honestly.

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Uh I think that I think uh, you know, a lot of um, you know, people come into therapy either they because they want to be in therapy or, you know, for instance, like, you know, mandatory wellness checks, right, for police officers, they kind of come in with, you know, a little of their backup as they should.

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I mean, you don't know who I am, you don't know what I'm gonna ask you.

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It's, you know, it can be kind of a little bit intimidating.

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And not that I'm intimidating, but the whole, the whole thing, people are gonna be asking you questions.

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It's so, you know, they don't know what to expect when they come in.

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Um, but my experience has been that once they're in, they're like, oh, this is not so bad.

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You know, I'm not sitting there with a clipboard staring at them with, you know, I'm I'm talking and they can swear and they can say whatever they want, and I swear.

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And we, it's just a conversation.

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And then I just kind of be like, you know, I'm I'm not gonna dig for problems where there are none.

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But at the same time, if there's something going on, I'm here.

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It's more letting them know that I'm there.

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And, you know, some people are like, oh, this is what therapy is.

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Like, I can just kind of come in and just talk.

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And I'm like, yeah, I'm like, if you want my insight, I can give you that.

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If you want me to, you know, give you an opinion or or help you solve a problem, we can do that.

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But let's go over the progress you're making and the wins that you have too.

00:16:51.369 --> 00:16:54.569
So it's kind of turning it on its head as to what therapy is.

00:16:54.809 --> 00:17:04.170
Um I don't think I I guess I would imagine that if somebody shows up and they come to the table that they've got some willingness because they're already there.

00:17:04.329 --> 00:17:06.170
You're not forcing them to be there, right?

00:17:06.490 --> 00:17:06.809
Yeah.

00:17:07.049 --> 00:17:07.529
Yep.

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They are.

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You know, they are.

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And I think it just it's they have to kind of decide how vulnerable they want to be and how much they want to share.

00:17:16.170 --> 00:17:16.490
Right.

00:17:16.650 --> 00:17:23.930
Um, because it's it can be really difficult to do that, and it it can be um putting yourself in a in a very vulnerable place.

00:17:24.970 --> 00:17:27.529
I tried to get my dad to go to therapy.

00:17:27.769 --> 00:17:31.130
Um last time I saw him, he goes, son, I couldn't do it.

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He goes, I went to the therapist and I sat there for 15 minutes and then I got up and walked out.

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He goes, I can't.

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You know, I'm 76 years old, and everything that I have, I'm just gonna carry it with me when I die.

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And that's heavy.

00:17:45.930 --> 00:17:47.529
I was just thinking to myself, like, how?

00:17:47.690 --> 00:17:48.890
Like how how do you do that?

00:17:49.049 --> 00:18:05.609
Like I I I had to hit rock bottom before, at least my personal rock bottom, uh, before I sought the help that I needed to get to process whether it was childhood trauma or it was anything that I experienced as an adult.

00:18:05.769 --> 00:18:13.529
Um and I always say a life of service is a life worth living, um, because at the end of the day, we all have an expiration date.

00:18:13.609 --> 00:18:15.690
We're all gonna die at some point in time.

00:18:16.009 --> 00:18:16.409
Yes.

00:18:16.730 --> 00:18:32.649
When I'm on my deathbed, I hope that I can look back at my life and have had an impact on others in a sense of not just money, but like an a positive impact where I helped others grow and I helped others have a better life.

00:18:32.730 --> 00:18:34.569
And I think that's why a lot of us get into this stuff.

00:18:34.649 --> 00:18:52.250
We don't get into this because we're power tripping and you know, we want, you know, I think at the end of the day we have something in our soul that tells us that we're meant to serve, and we're and just like with you, just like what you just talked about, like you could go do easy therapy.

00:18:52.490 --> 00:18:54.250
What I call easy therapy.

00:18:54.730 --> 00:18:57.369
Uh that there's there's easy therapy out there, right?

00:18:57.450 --> 00:18:57.529
Yeah.

00:18:57.690 --> 00:19:03.609
But at the end of the day, some of the toughest clients that I've ever seen before are your military and are your law enforcement clients.

00:19:04.009 --> 00:19:05.769
And so I I really appreciate that.

00:19:05.849 --> 00:19:07.929
And talk about my end of the spectrum.

00:19:08.009 --> 00:19:13.529
What are the misconceptions first responders have about therapy in general?

00:19:13.929 --> 00:19:21.690
Uh, I think that some of the misconceptions are judgment that there's going to be this separation.

00:19:21.849 --> 00:19:37.529
Like, I'm going to be, you know, looking at you and and uh dissecting you and calling you out on things and oh, you said this, so this must mean this, and you must have this, and everybody's got PTSD and all this other stuff, and it just doesn't work that way.

00:19:37.769 --> 00:19:39.529
Um, but I get it.

00:19:39.609 --> 00:19:46.409
I I think that it's healthy to sort of be a little bit, even if they're booking the appointment, it's still okay to come in a little bit on guard.

00:19:46.569 --> 00:19:48.089
I think that's that's normal.

00:19:48.169 --> 00:19:51.129
That and that hypervigilance is also just part of the job, right?

00:19:51.210 --> 00:19:52.730
So it makes sense.

00:19:52.970 --> 00:19:58.169
Um and you don't have to trust, you know, they're not gonna trust me right away unless they they know me.

00:19:58.329 --> 00:20:05.289
I mean, I do meet people at events and stuff, so they get to know me a little bit and then they might call me to to book something that's different.

00:20:05.450 --> 00:20:23.929
Um but I think that the misconceptions are that it's it's very one-sided, that um everything's gonna be dissected, that they're gonna just be seen as a specimen and a cliche, and uh that's just not the case at all for me.

00:20:24.250 --> 00:20:30.009
That's uh for my clients, you know, and I I feel like my approach has been pretty successful so far.

00:20:30.169 --> 00:20:35.529
But you don't you don't mesh with every therapist, you don't mesh with every client, you're your people.

00:20:35.769 --> 00:20:40.490
So, you know, I don't take offense if someone's just like I'm kind of all sad, I'd rather see somebody else.

00:20:40.649 --> 00:20:43.049
Okay, well we can figure that out.

00:20:43.210 --> 00:20:50.970
But overall, it's it's been um I think that those misconceptions have kind of gone out the window once they've met me, to be honest with you.

00:20:51.609 --> 00:20:52.009
Yeah.

00:20:52.569 --> 00:20:55.289
Yeah, it's it's a tough crowd, um, for sure.

00:20:55.450 --> 00:20:58.490
Uh over the years, over the years I've seen some crazy stuff.

00:20:58.649 --> 00:21:06.089
Um what what do you think keeps strong men and women in uniform from seeking counseling initially?

00:21:07.129 --> 00:21:08.889
Well, there's various barriers to treatment.

00:21:08.970 --> 00:21:14.970
I mean, it's definitely the stigma um we're getting there, you know, we're chipping away at it, but it's still very strong.

00:21:15.129 --> 00:21:29.609
There's still a stigma generally about mental health in in general and the general population, but then you have um your responders and military who, you know, you you they are the strongest people in the world, right?

00:21:29.690 --> 00:21:30.809
They are the strongest.

00:21:30.970 --> 00:21:41.049
They're sacrificing, they're giving pieces of themselves away, whether it's sacrificing time or sacrificing um, I mean, lives and everything in between.

00:21:41.210 --> 00:21:46.169
Oh asking for help, it's can be you know seen as a sign of weakness.

00:21:46.329 --> 00:21:49.609
It's not, but it has been perpetuated that way.

00:21:49.690 --> 00:21:52.649
That I'm strong, I should be able to deal with this, I should be able to carry this.

00:21:52.730 --> 00:21:54.089
This is what I signed up for.

00:21:54.250 --> 00:21:59.529
But you're a human being, you know, under the uniform, behind the badge, under the helmet, you're a human being first.

00:21:59.609 --> 00:22:01.289
There's no getting rid of that.

00:22:01.450 --> 00:22:02.569
Do you carry it differently?

00:22:02.730 --> 00:22:04.329
Sure, but you still carry it.

00:22:04.569 --> 00:22:06.649
Um, so I think stigma is huge.

00:22:06.809 --> 00:22:10.250
And then, you know, you said men and women, and you're absolutely right.

00:22:10.409 --> 00:22:15.769
Um, but men are more at risk at this stage of the game.

00:22:16.009 --> 00:22:26.569
There's um we have a men's mental health crisis in this country generally, and then within these communities, um, the rate is a lot higher, the suicide rate is a lot higher.

00:22:26.730 --> 00:22:28.730
So we want to provide help to everyone.

00:22:28.889 --> 00:22:34.490
I have both male and female clients um in the responder military communities.

00:22:34.569 --> 00:22:43.049
Uh, but we also have to take that into account, too, is that a lot of times there's stigma attached to being a man and just suck it up and deal with it.

00:22:43.210 --> 00:22:46.569
And, you know, that's what men have been doing all these years.

00:22:46.730 --> 00:22:55.210
And, you know, then you look back and it's like how many war heroes um suffered with PTSD when they didn't know what it was and things like that.

00:22:55.369 --> 00:22:58.569
So we're we're dealing with Stigma that's been around a long time.

00:22:58.809 --> 00:23:00.089
So overcoming that.

00:23:00.169 --> 00:23:08.730
And then also having culturally competent clinicians, which is basically is just another word for therapists that get it.

00:23:09.049 --> 00:23:16.329
So I'm really proud to be part of a group and a growing community of therapists who specialize.

00:23:16.569 --> 00:23:20.730
And it is great to have because sometimes I'm like, I need support.

00:23:20.970 --> 00:23:23.849
Um, or I need to figure out how to do this.

00:23:24.009 --> 00:23:33.369
This, you know, I have a client who without breaching confidentiality, of course, but like, you know, networking with people who this is what we do, this is who we take care of.

00:23:33.609 --> 00:23:49.129
Um so it's just overcoming those barriers and just normalizing it, just talking about it and talking about it and um having agencies and leadership talk about it and, you know, people like yourself putting it out here and being brave enough to actually talk about it.

00:23:49.289 --> 00:23:52.009
Um, and hopefully that'll help save some people.

00:23:52.490 --> 00:23:52.809
Yeah.

00:23:53.049 --> 00:24:09.049
That's one thing I love about doing this sort of thing is instead of you and I just having a conversation in front in front of like a handful of people, I'm able to actually broadcast this to the world and hopefully get this, uh, get this in the ears of folks out there that need to hear this sort of conversation.

00:24:09.450 --> 00:24:20.490
Um, you you're so passionate about what you're doing that you decided to go back to school instead of continuing to be a pure advocate on this.

00:24:20.730 --> 00:24:23.129
Um, why did you consider to do that?

00:24:23.529 --> 00:24:29.369
I was not really happy in my original career, which was public relations, beauty, and fashion industry.

00:24:29.529 --> 00:24:32.409
It was fun, but I didn't really find any purpose in it.

00:24:32.569 --> 00:24:43.450
Uh in spring 2021, I had a cop call me who had another cop who was struggling, and he's like, Can you talk to him before I find him professional help?

00:24:43.609 --> 00:24:48.490
And I said, Yeah, you know, with a disclaimer at that point, I'm like, I'm just a regular person, I can listen.

00:24:48.730 --> 00:24:51.690
And that was the day, like I was like, all right, I'm going back to school.

00:24:51.849 --> 00:24:53.690
I don't, I don't know how, I don't know where.

00:24:53.849 --> 00:24:55.129
I've been out of college forever.

00:24:55.210 --> 00:24:57.049
I don't, I don't even know what I'm doing.

00:24:57.210 --> 00:24:58.889
But I was like, I'm gonna go back to school.

00:24:58.970 --> 00:25:00.409
And everything just kind of lined up.

00:25:00.490 --> 00:25:01.609
I found this program.

00:25:01.929 --> 00:25:06.809
Um, I work very closely with an organization called Reps for Responders out of New York.

00:25:07.129 --> 00:25:13.129
And through them, I was able to find this master's program, specifically emergency responder and military psych.

00:25:13.609 --> 00:25:19.450
And I was like, why don't I just become the professional that I'm referring people to?

00:25:19.529 --> 00:25:22.250
And that way I can actually help on that level.

00:25:22.490 --> 00:25:31.289
Uh, so I I enrolled, I worked full-time while I uh did my degree and um just kind of went from there.

00:25:31.450 --> 00:25:33.289
It's all just fallen into place.

00:25:33.769 --> 00:25:45.289
Uh looking back, it's it was um, it all makes sense, but you know, it was kind of you know up and down and can be messy and things like that as you go for your goals and things like that.

00:25:45.529 --> 00:25:48.009
But yeah, so far, uh so far, so good.

00:25:48.169 --> 00:25:49.129
And here we are.

00:25:49.529 --> 00:25:50.569
Yeah, that's the thing too.

00:25:50.649 --> 00:26:03.849
Like a lot of us try to forecast and predict uh what direction we want to go in life, and sometimes just maturing experience, uh, you have a change of heart, change of mind.

00:26:04.250 --> 00:26:12.490
And I've known people like that before that it sounds crazy, but they'll be on a trajectory to head into the business world, for example.

00:26:12.649 --> 00:26:25.849
And as they're taking that journey and they're headed down that azimuth of life, something happens and then they're like, well, wait a second, maybe I want to become a police officer or a firefighter, or no, maybe I want to join the military.

00:26:26.009 --> 00:26:34.649
And it sounds crazy, but as much as we try to predict like where we're gonna go and where we're gonna end up, I mean, life just happens and um we have that higher calling, right?

00:26:35.129 --> 00:26:35.609
That's it.

00:26:35.769 --> 00:26:36.329
Exactly.

00:26:36.649 --> 00:26:37.049
Exactly.

00:26:37.129 --> 00:26:39.529
It's you know, it's kind of God's timing, not ours.

00:26:39.769 --> 00:26:55.210
We can plan as much as we want to, but um, we end up on our our path, and it doesn't always seem clear at the time, or it can seem kind of unknown and scary at times, but then you look back and it's like, oh, that's why it went that way, and that's why the road kind of went zigzag this way.

00:26:55.529 --> 00:26:56.809
Now it all makes sense.

00:26:57.210 --> 00:26:57.529
Right.

00:26:57.690 --> 00:26:58.169
100%.

00:26:58.809 --> 00:27:03.049
Now you earned your master's in emergency responder in military psychology, right?

00:27:03.289 --> 00:27:03.609
Mm-hmm.

00:27:03.769 --> 00:27:04.169
Yep.

00:27:04.809 --> 00:27:09.369
So what what did that teach you that was surprising?

00:27:09.609 --> 00:27:13.049
Was there anything about that that was kind of like, well, that's uh I didn't know that before.

00:27:13.210 --> 00:27:16.889
That was interesting, or that turned over a new, a new rock for me.

00:27:17.289 --> 00:27:21.529
Yeah, how new it is, how new PTSD is being studied.

00:27:21.609 --> 00:27:31.929
You know, we're so many of us are so used to hearing post-traumatic stress disorder, but it's relatively new, only within the last, you know, 30 or 40 years, police suicide only the last 30 years.

00:27:32.089 --> 00:27:36.490
So you think about um the fact that it's all very new.

00:27:36.649 --> 00:27:41.210
I mean, it sounds, you know, oh, 30 years, but I mean, think about 30 years is is nothing.

00:27:41.529 --> 00:27:49.049
So um understanding that this has only been studied for a very short period of time was was kind of, I was taken aback by it.

00:27:49.129 --> 00:27:50.809
But I was in that space.

00:27:50.970 --> 00:28:03.929
So I read about it and I knew about it, but um, you know, it it's still being studied and it's still being um discovered, you know, that PTSD is really related to post-traumatic stress injuries.

00:28:04.089 --> 00:28:11.289
So when you see trauma, it can, you know, it can injure the brain, and that's what can call these, cause these, you know, these mental health symptoms.

00:28:11.369 --> 00:28:20.970
And it helps people understand that instead of just thinking something's wrong with me or I'm not strong enough, or why is it effect not affecting him, but affecting me, and and things of that nature.

00:28:21.129 --> 00:28:24.250
Uh, so I think that was what I was most surprised by.

00:28:24.490 --> 00:28:27.769
Um, but the the overall program was incredible.

00:28:27.929 --> 00:28:34.970
I mean, it was just it was just really um very comprehensive, and I had amazing professors.

00:28:35.129 --> 00:28:37.690
And unfortunately, the program actually shut down.

00:28:37.769 --> 00:28:47.769
We were thinking it would grow because of this specialty, but um, they unfortunately had low enrollment, but I got grandfathered in, so I was able to stay and graduate.

00:28:48.009 --> 00:28:49.049
So very cool.

00:28:49.289 --> 00:28:54.490
You know what's funny is um I was an early war veteran, I would say fairly early.

00:28:54.649 --> 00:28:57.849
I um deployed in 2004-2005.

00:28:58.250 --> 00:29:01.289
I had an experience uh running over an IED.

00:29:01.369 --> 00:29:10.649
I actually had several experiences um being in, I guess what you would call like ambush attacks or whatever with insurgents.

00:29:10.970 --> 00:29:16.730
The funny thing is, is like in 2004, 2005, TBI wasn't even a thing.

00:29:16.889 --> 00:29:19.129
Traumatic brain injury was not a thing.

00:29:19.450 --> 00:29:30.409
When we got assessed at the next base that we went to after hitting our our IED, which by the way, a piece of the IED is right here behind me under my bronze star in this frame right here.

00:29:30.649 --> 00:29:38.250
Oh wow, yeah, it's a piece that I I it's on my wall that reminds me about you know the importance of life.

00:29:38.809 --> 00:29:44.009
Um when we went to our next base, it was just a matter of, hey, you guys okay?

00:29:44.169 --> 00:29:46.809
You got any uh scrapes or anything on you?

00:29:46.889 --> 00:29:48.889
And uh, okay, you got this, you got that.

00:29:48.970 --> 00:29:52.649
And that there was no like nothing up here was examined at all.

00:29:53.609 --> 00:29:56.490
You know, and this was in 2004, 2005.

00:29:56.569 --> 00:30:00.169
And a few years later I started hearing about TBI injuries, and I'm like, what's that?

00:30:00.329 --> 00:30:02.409
And I'm I was like, I didn't get assessed for that.

00:30:02.490 --> 00:30:04.250
So you talking about PTSD.

00:30:04.409 --> 00:30:06.329
I mean, yeah, it is it is a new thing.

00:30:06.409 --> 00:30:09.369
It it's uh before that, it was suck it up and drive on.

00:30:09.609 --> 00:30:10.089
That's it.

00:30:10.329 --> 00:30:10.649
No.

00:30:11.450 --> 00:30:14.809
So you're partnering with the East Providence uh police department.

00:30:15.210 --> 00:30:18.409
Um what what's your role with them?

00:30:18.889 --> 00:30:20.649
Uh so that's my hometown department.

00:30:20.809 --> 00:30:21.929
So they're near and dear.

00:30:22.009 --> 00:30:22.889
I love them very much.

00:30:23.049 --> 00:30:25.529
Uh so I am their clinician.

00:30:25.609 --> 00:30:29.289
So we contracted with them to provide mental health services.

00:30:29.450 --> 00:30:38.169
So I do anything from crisis management to critical incident debriefs uh to uh these wellness checks that we're doing.

00:30:38.329 --> 00:30:39.929
So it's a proactive wellness check.

00:30:40.009 --> 00:30:47.529
It is mandatory, so that can, you know, cause a little, you know, some people don't like uh to hear that something's mandatory, which I totally understand.

00:30:47.690 --> 00:30:50.889
Um, but so far it's all been going really well.

00:30:51.049 --> 00:30:52.970
Basically, if they need anything, I'm there.

00:30:53.049 --> 00:30:55.929
I live two minutes down the street from the station.

00:30:56.089 --> 00:31:04.490
Unfortunately, in Rhode Island, we've had two uh mass casualty uh incidents in 2026.

00:31:04.730 --> 00:31:08.169
So uh I debriefed the guys that were at those calls.

00:31:08.409 --> 00:31:16.009
The Brown University shooting was a was kind of went viral around because it was such a it was such a big thing in Providence.

00:31:16.250 --> 00:31:27.450
Um so that was that was good to be able to just go and support them and see, you know, if you're okay, if there's anything we can do, um just kind of provide that support and just open the door.

00:31:27.609 --> 00:31:30.169
Basically, that's what the wellness checks are for, too.

00:31:30.409 --> 00:31:34.889
Is, you know, I and I tell every single one of them, I'm not gonna dig for stuff that's not there.

00:31:34.970 --> 00:31:35.849
If you're good, you're good.

00:31:35.929 --> 00:31:36.490
That's fine.

00:31:36.649 --> 00:31:40.809
But just so you know that if you do need to talk to me, I'm here.

00:31:40.889 --> 00:31:45.609
You know, I'm in my off, I'm in the office, which is near the station four days a week.

00:31:45.769 --> 00:31:48.250
I can always go to the station if they need me.

00:31:48.490 --> 00:31:54.889
Um we have a ridiculous amount of snow, but once it melts, uh, I do um walking sessions.

00:31:55.049 --> 00:31:59.690
So if somebody wants to meet up and go for a walk and talk, as opposed to sitting in the office, we can do that too.

00:31:59.929 --> 00:32:05.129
So it's just opening the door and like basically introducing to that like the holding space.

00:32:05.210 --> 00:32:07.450
I was talking about like, oh, hey, this is your space.

00:32:07.690 --> 00:32:08.569
And it's held for you.

00:32:08.649 --> 00:32:12.329
So if you'd like it, anytime you want to use it, you're able to use it.

00:32:12.569 --> 00:32:17.210
Um, so you know, and and they're my hometown department and they're wonderful.

00:32:17.369 --> 00:32:21.289
They they're always just amazing and take such good care of our community.

00:32:21.529 --> 00:32:24.730
So it's good to be able to serve them in this way.

00:32:25.369 --> 00:32:25.929
Yeah.

00:32:26.250 --> 00:32:27.690
It sounds super impactful.

00:32:27.769 --> 00:32:33.049
Now, the proactive wellness checks that you're talking about, how is that different from a crisis response?

00:32:33.529 --> 00:32:36.009
So these are I'm meeting with every officer.

00:32:36.169 --> 00:32:44.970
So I just have a series of questions I ask them, I just introduce myself, kind of tell them like this is what we're doing, this is what is available to you.

00:32:45.129 --> 00:32:53.210
Um, so that if they ever do want to talk or process things, and it doesn't have to be, you know, anything like someone is in crisis or someone is suicidal.

00:32:53.369 --> 00:32:55.529
Obviously, you know, we'll definitely help with that.

00:32:55.609 --> 00:32:59.210
I mean, we have resources to be able to help with any situation.

00:32:59.529 --> 00:33:05.289
Um, but it's just sort of proactive like, hey, this is what we offer if you ever need it.

00:33:05.369 --> 00:33:08.089
If you ever need to process something, not even work-related.

00:33:08.409 --> 00:33:15.210
You know, people have things going on at home, you know, um, you know, family things, relationship things, whatever the case may be.

00:33:15.369 --> 00:33:21.929
It's just sort of opening that door and letting them know, hey, you can walk through this whenever you want, and I've I've got you, basically.

00:33:22.649 --> 00:33:23.289
Yeah.

00:33:23.690 --> 00:33:36.409
That's uh that's super important for someone to offer because sometimes it's the quiet ones that are the most successful when it comes to suicide and just losing themselves, right?

00:33:36.889 --> 00:33:37.129
Yeah.

00:33:37.289 --> 00:33:40.409
I mean, it's it's really just, you know, it can be the quiet ones.

00:33:40.490 --> 00:33:43.929
It can also be the loud, laughing, strong.

00:33:44.250 --> 00:33:44.409
Yeah.

00:33:44.649 --> 00:33:45.849
You know, you just don't know.

00:33:45.929 --> 00:33:46.809
You just check on everybody.

00:33:46.889 --> 00:33:50.250
It's like I'd rather annoy people and check on them than risk not asking.

00:33:50.409 --> 00:33:51.289
Like I've told people that.

00:33:51.369 --> 00:33:52.730
I'm like, I'm probably going to annoy you.

00:33:52.809 --> 00:33:58.970
I really don't care because I'd rather check and make sure you're okay than not ask you, and maybe that, maybe you're not.

00:33:59.129 --> 00:34:11.530
And I'm not taking overall responsibility for people, like, but at the same time, it's like it takes two seconds to send a text or just say, hey, I haven't heard from you a while, or just just checking in, just saying hello, and and things like that.

00:34:11.769 --> 00:34:15.210
So um, you know, it's it's tough.

00:34:15.369 --> 00:34:19.210
The whole suicide thing is is very, very tough.

00:34:19.530 --> 00:34:21.450
But we just try to do do what we can.

00:34:21.849 --> 00:34:29.929
It's it's so tough to hear sometimes when people say, you know, when when someone does commit suicide and and you hear friends and family say, I don't understand.

00:34:30.090 --> 00:34:39.130
Like just yesterday, they were they were laughing, they were joking, they were you know, that that's so hard to hear, especially when children are involved.

00:34:39.289 --> 00:34:50.010
When you when people leave children behind, um that I mean, you just imagine like how dark things must be for them behind closed doors.

00:34:50.250 --> 00:35:02.809
And so being proactive and having a department actually take mental health that serious to where they're not being reactive, but they're being proactive, I think is that's exactly that's exactly it.

00:35:02.970 --> 00:35:03.530
Yes.

00:35:03.769 --> 00:35:06.650
And you you know, it's beautifully stated that yeah, it is dark.

00:35:06.730 --> 00:35:08.730
It is a dark, dark, terrible place.

00:35:08.969 --> 00:35:16.250
I uh unfortunately lost someone that I was close to um almost two weeks ago, uh law enforcement officer.

00:35:16.489 --> 00:35:20.969
And it's I mean, you just don't really know what to do with it, honestly.

00:35:21.049 --> 00:35:28.009
And it's and I've I've cried for, you know, cops and and m soldiers and responders I've never met.

00:35:28.090 --> 00:35:32.730
So to know someone um is is it's gut-wrenching.

00:35:32.889 --> 00:35:39.610
But it's like also, you know, it's like a fire that now it's like, all right, we've got to and he got help.

00:35:39.690 --> 00:35:43.049
It was just sorry, it would just um became all consuming.

00:35:43.130 --> 00:35:51.130
And it is, it's a dark, terrible place, and nothing makes sense and nothing's logical, and you can't rationalize it, you know.

00:35:51.369 --> 00:36:04.090
But at the same time, it's kind of just like lighting a fire, like, all right, we've got to get out there and at least try and at least if if you know, extend someone's life or at least try to try to help them as much as we can.

00:36:04.250 --> 00:36:07.610
And ultimately, it's just worth the fight.

00:36:08.090 --> 00:36:08.650
Yeah.

00:36:08.969 --> 00:36:19.769
You've got so many things going on, you know, whether military or law enforcement, you've got the work to do, you've got personal shit going on at home, you've got your own demons that you're dealing with.

00:36:20.009 --> 00:36:26.969
I mean, sometimes you just feel like you don't have any direction to look to where anything is actually clear.

00:36:27.210 --> 00:36:27.690
Exactly.

00:36:27.929 --> 00:36:31.529
And um, you know, that can be a real challenge in itself.

00:36:31.769 --> 00:36:43.049
Talking about um traumatic uh trauma, you know, after a traumatic call from your studies and what you know and your experience, what is actually happening neurologically in an officer's body?

00:36:44.170 --> 00:36:46.329
Um so many things.

00:36:46.489 --> 00:36:56.489
I mean, the the rush of adrenaline, you know, um, they can get hypervigilant, hyperfocused, uh can get that tunnel vision.

00:36:56.730 --> 00:37:01.610
Um there's a lot of unknowns, so that's where that hypervigilance comes into play.

00:37:01.769 --> 00:37:04.889
So the body is tense, the the adrenaline is pumping.

00:37:04.969 --> 00:37:09.289
And the thing with adrenaline is that once it pumps into your system, it has to dump out.

00:37:09.449 --> 00:37:17.690
So once the threat is neutralized, it it's exhausting because your body is kind of, you know, resetting.

00:37:17.849 --> 00:37:21.130
Um the nervous system kind of goes into overdrive.

00:37:21.289 --> 00:37:22.250
It depends on the situation.

00:37:22.409 --> 00:37:27.849
Like I'll give you an example, the um the shooting I was talking about at Brown University in Providence.

00:37:28.009 --> 00:37:33.210
Um, this guy went and shot up a bunch of different buildings and unfortunately um killed a few people.

00:37:33.449 --> 00:37:43.210
So when my officers went in, and Rhode Island's, I mean, we're so small, every single police agency, an entire state, sent SWAT and sent people to the campus.

00:37:43.690 --> 00:37:47.849
So their mission at that point was to clear all the buildings.

00:37:48.170 --> 00:37:55.610
So it was like they were just focused on clearing every building, got backing each other up.

00:37:55.929 --> 00:38:03.529
Um got your six literally as they are going through each building on the campus, which it's a big campus.

00:38:03.849 --> 00:38:11.690
Um, so you know, they shared with me like that tunnel vision and that just like focus, like not thinking about anything else besides what I'm supposed to do.

00:38:11.929 --> 00:38:16.650
Um so that kind of, but that all takes such a toll on the body.

00:38:16.809 --> 00:38:27.289
So neurologically, you're vigilant and you're looking and you're you're watching, and you're not only just watching for yourself, you're watching for your guys, which is a different level of responsibility.

00:38:27.529 --> 00:38:32.009
Um, and then physically your body's going through all these things, and then after you have to recover.

00:38:32.170 --> 00:38:35.529
So you're exhausted, your body's dumping adrenaline.

00:38:35.690 --> 00:38:40.329
Um, and then if you do see something traumatic, it it can injure your brain.

00:38:40.409 --> 00:38:48.650
It's different than a um a TBI, but uh when you think, you know, if you see something horrible, it's it's like a it's like a cut, right?

00:38:48.730 --> 00:38:51.049
Like let's say you cut, you have a little cut.

00:38:51.289 --> 00:38:55.929
Um it'll bleed, it'll hurt for a little bit, and it'll heal, but it'll always be there.

00:38:56.090 --> 00:38:59.289
It's not like you can't have a cut on your skin and it's like it was never there.

00:38:59.449 --> 00:39:00.889
So it's the same thing with the brain.

00:39:01.049 --> 00:39:06.409
So it can cause just mental health symptoms as opposed to um physical symptoms.

00:39:06.650 --> 00:39:10.889
So with trauma, you know, it and it affects everyone differently.

00:39:11.049 --> 00:39:15.130
So, you know, three cops can be on the same scene, they're gonna have three different reactions.

00:39:15.369 --> 00:39:22.809
Somebody could be traumatized, somebody could not, someone could just have a medium reaction, and nobody's wrong.

00:39:22.969 --> 00:39:24.650
There's no wrong reaction.

00:39:24.889 --> 00:39:28.889
Um, it's it reactions are as individual as the people who have them.

00:39:29.289 --> 00:39:33.369
I have told a story similar to that so many times.

00:39:33.610 --> 00:39:39.769
Um and it it's amazing to me how what you just said about the three cops on the scene.

00:39:39.929 --> 00:39:42.009
That's true, 1,000% true.

00:39:42.329 --> 00:39:46.889
And the the big biggest problem that I've experienced before is association.

00:39:47.130 --> 00:39:56.969
So if I see a little girl, that little girl that I see, I associate to being my daughter or a niece or a family member.

00:39:57.210 --> 00:39:59.449
And that's true, that's hard to do.

00:39:59.690 --> 00:40:15.849
And I remember when I was younger, and whenever we were involved in a fatality uh type of event outside the wire, the younger version of me was able to disassociate that person with anything that was tied to me.

00:40:16.009 --> 00:40:21.690
I was I looked at that as just a son of a bitch that signed up for the same thing that I did.

00:40:22.009 --> 00:40:26.489
If it was a dead civilian, um, then they're at the wrong place, wrong time.

00:40:26.650 --> 00:40:33.130
Whatever I had to do to not associate that person with reality, I I did that.

00:40:33.289 --> 00:40:44.969
But what was amazing to me was afterwards, other soldiers would come up and be like, well, that was somebody's uncle, or that was, you know, he had kids, or you know, because uh we, you know, fortunately, my unit we didn't take on any casualties.

00:40:45.369 --> 00:40:49.210
I didn't lose anyone in my company the entire time I was in Iraq.

00:40:49.369 --> 00:40:58.090
Um, you know, we were blessed that that didn't happen because the unit before us took on a lot of casualties, but we did take on casualties as far as civilians um that were helping us out.

00:40:58.250 --> 00:41:01.210
And for me, like I was always like, whatever.

00:41:01.369 --> 00:41:04.489
Like that guy signed up to get paid and he paid the ultimate price.

00:41:04.570 --> 00:41:12.489
And that may sound morbid or whatever, but that's how I mentally made it through that time, right?

00:41:12.650 --> 00:41:23.849
And another thing you talked about too was you talked about people expect you to just switch on when you're getting tunnel visioned and you're looking to clear buildings and things like that.

00:41:24.090 --> 00:41:28.170
People expect you to become a machine, but you're not a machine, you're a human being.

00:41:28.409 --> 00:41:38.170
Your hydration levels, what you had to eat, um, what's going on at home, all that shit plays a part in your decision-making process when you're under stress and anxiety and you're having to think on your feet.

00:41:38.489 --> 00:41:39.289
And it's so funny.

00:41:39.369 --> 00:41:43.690
I talked about the the shoe salesman that like tends to judge you, right?

00:41:44.009 --> 00:41:46.650
Um, you know, and and and what you're doing in your job.

00:41:46.809 --> 00:41:58.650
Well, then they well, one thing they don't understand is like you might have been sitting for three hours waiting and playbooking how to do this, and then now it's like get up and perform.

00:41:58.889 --> 00:42:04.170
You have to be like mentally and physically ready to do that, and it's it's so difficult to do.

00:42:04.570 --> 00:42:06.730
Um and yeah, that's that's the thing.

00:42:06.809 --> 00:42:09.610
You're not a machine, you're not a switch that just gets flipped on and off.

00:42:09.769 --> 00:42:16.889
And those are the trials and tribulations of like what law enforcement and what military members in combat go through.

00:42:17.529 --> 00:42:21.130
Um when we're looking at one another, Becky.

00:42:21.610 --> 00:42:28.489
What warning signs should fellow officers or military veterans look for e look for in one another?

00:42:30.329 --> 00:42:35.849
There's so many different things that you can look for, but it's not always visible.

00:42:36.170 --> 00:42:39.130
It's usually I think it's just checking in constantly on people.

00:42:39.210 --> 00:42:42.730
And not you don't have to like bug everybody, be like, hey, okay, okay, okay.

00:42:42.889 --> 00:42:44.009
Um leave that to me.

00:42:44.170 --> 00:42:49.049
But but um just kind of you know, just kind of checking on people.

00:42:49.130 --> 00:42:53.769
And if you know they're going through something, um, you know, see how they're doing.

00:42:53.929 --> 00:42:56.730
But I think it's just a matter of constant presence.

00:42:57.049 --> 00:43:08.489
You know, if you do know someone is going through something really bad at home, like a bad divorce or they've had lost people or there's something serious going on, definitely check in.

00:43:08.570 --> 00:43:10.090
You don't have to have every detail.

00:43:10.250 --> 00:43:13.210
They don't have to give you every detail, but just like, hey, I'm here for you.

00:43:13.289 --> 00:43:15.929
You know, I'm, you know, I know you're going through something.

00:43:16.170 --> 00:43:18.250
Um, you know, and and things like that.

00:43:18.329 --> 00:43:21.289
Because unfortunately, not all the the signs are are visible.

00:43:21.369 --> 00:43:26.969
And there can be somebody that's getting help that it's still, you know, may not be enough.

00:43:27.210 --> 00:43:33.210
Um, so I think it's just really checking on everyone, really, and just creating that morale and that camaraderie.

00:43:33.369 --> 00:43:39.929
You don't have to be best friends with everybody at work, but that doesn't mean you don't check on people and just make sure, you know, everybody's okay.

00:43:40.090 --> 00:43:44.570
You know, and to your point before about like it being um morbid, it's really not.

00:43:45.049 --> 00:43:51.130
A lot of um responders when they first meet with me are kind of like, like, oh, I know this is gonna sound bad.

00:43:51.210 --> 00:43:51.929
I'm like, it's not.

00:43:52.009 --> 00:43:54.570
It's actually a survival, it's a survival mechanism.

00:43:54.730 --> 00:43:57.210
Like, honestly, it's the same thing with dark humor.

00:43:57.369 --> 00:44:04.809
I mean, it literally dark humor is a scientific biological safety mechanism when you're on a scene.

00:44:04.889 --> 00:44:15.289
If you're if you're at a horrible scene where you're seeing stuff no one is supposed to see, you know, violent things and stuff like that, and you know, you make like a a dark joke.

00:44:15.449 --> 00:44:16.809
It's not that you don't care.

00:44:16.889 --> 00:44:26.170
It's because you're releasing serotonin into your system so your body can calm down a little bit so that you're not, you know, you're not, you're seeing stuff no one else is supposed to see.

00:44:26.250 --> 00:44:27.769
Yes, it's the job, but it doesn't matter.

00:44:27.849 --> 00:44:30.009
It's still not anything anyone is supposed to see.

00:44:30.250 --> 00:44:33.769
We're not, we're not um built to see so much of it as well.

00:44:33.929 --> 00:44:38.969
Your um your exposure to trauma is exponentially more than the average civilian.

00:44:39.130 --> 00:44:48.009
So dark humor and sort of, you know, kind of compartmentalizing things or just, you know, kind of not feeling anything, those are all protective measures.

00:44:48.170 --> 00:44:56.409
The only time we get concerned is if you do have a strong trauma response and you kind of suppress it because it's going to manifest.

00:44:56.889 --> 00:44:58.090
In other some other way.

00:44:58.250 --> 00:44:58.409
Right.

00:44:58.650 --> 00:45:06.170
But I tell a lot of my officers, and I think sometimes they're relieved when I'm like, it's okay if you don't have a reaction.

00:45:06.329 --> 00:45:07.849
It doesn't mean you're desensitized.

00:45:07.929 --> 00:45:09.690
It doesn't mean you've lost your humanity.

00:45:09.849 --> 00:45:12.090
You're not going to be emotionally invested in everything.

00:45:12.170 --> 00:45:12.650
You can't be.

00:45:12.730 --> 00:45:13.529
You'll burn out.

00:45:13.769 --> 00:45:16.009
You cannot be emotionally invested in everything.

00:45:16.170 --> 00:45:18.329
Are there going to be calls where you are invested?

00:45:18.489 --> 00:45:19.049
Of course.

00:45:19.210 --> 00:45:20.409
It can't be everything.

00:45:20.570 --> 00:45:25.449
So if you don't have a reaction or something doesn't bother you, it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you.

00:45:25.610 --> 00:45:29.529
It's just the way that your your brain is processing things, and that's okay.

00:45:29.929 --> 00:45:39.369
It's amazing to me because I've spoken to counselors, therapists over the years, you know, on profession and on not on profession, just off to the side.

00:45:39.529 --> 00:45:47.369
And it's amazing to me how there's so many different takes on understanding, like what you just talked to me about right now.

00:45:47.529 --> 00:45:49.849
Like dark humor, for example.

00:45:50.090 --> 00:45:57.449
I had an interview early on in my podcast career where I was very new and I was afraid to say something.

00:45:57.529 --> 00:46:00.889
And I had this guy come on and he goes, There's no such thing as dark humor.

00:46:00.969 --> 00:46:02.969
Either it's unfunny or blah, blah, blah.

00:46:03.130 --> 00:46:11.449
And I'm like, bro, like your experience in the military is like compared to me, is like this, this right here.

00:46:11.529 --> 00:46:14.009
And not only that, but under stress and anxiety, it's like that.

00:46:14.250 --> 00:46:21.610
And I didn't I I end up just cutting that part out of the podcast altogether because I didn't agree with it at all.

00:46:21.769 --> 00:46:24.969
And I was just like, that's not what I want to be putting out.

00:46:25.210 --> 00:46:33.529
But yeah, like sometimes when you're looking into the abyss and you're looking into the darkness, you have to be able to laugh.

00:46:33.849 --> 00:46:37.610
You have to be able to feel something other than like dread.

00:46:37.849 --> 00:46:38.409
That's exactly what I'm saying.

00:46:38.650 --> 00:46:39.289
So 1,000%.

00:46:39.690 --> 00:46:43.529
If I could redo that interview again with that guy, I would I would tune him up.

00:46:43.769 --> 00:46:46.730
And I hope I run into him in person because I know who I know who I'm talking about.

00:46:46.809 --> 00:47:02.730
And now that I've done this for three years and I've got a little bit more uh under me now to where like I am not afraid to say something, you know, I would like to set him straight because like being a law enforcement officer and like being much older now, yeah, dark humor is a thing, and it is okay.

00:47:02.889 --> 00:47:05.769
Um it's how you look into the abyss and you laugh.

00:47:06.009 --> 00:47:07.130
It's how you process.

00:47:07.529 --> 00:47:08.329
Yeah, of course.

00:47:08.409 --> 00:47:23.849
And it's, I mean, you know, it's it's a I mean, uh for me, honestly, and on a personal level, it's been a connector for me for people because I have a pretty I have a good sense of humor, and I, you know, and I mean there's a lot of funny things online too, so and I've cop friends, so I'll send it to I mean, some of this stuff really pushes the envelope, but it's still funny.

00:47:23.929 --> 00:47:24.889
I can still laugh at it.

00:47:24.969 --> 00:47:32.170
I may not share it because it's like I'm a therapist, but um, but it is, you know, I I've told I've educated people on that too.

00:47:32.250 --> 00:47:33.769
I'm like, listen, it's okay.

00:47:33.929 --> 00:47:36.170
It's it's a coping mechanism, it's all right.

00:47:36.329 --> 00:47:42.009
It's just a matter of like, you know, if you laugh at things or um you have to.

00:47:42.170 --> 00:47:42.650
You have to.

00:47:42.969 --> 00:47:49.289
It's just, you know, and like you said, it's to feel something because sometimes you numb and sometimes you feel nothing and you feel frozen.

00:47:49.610 --> 00:47:57.449
And that can be okay if you don't have a reaction, but sometimes you want to just feel something.

00:47:57.610 --> 00:48:01.610
And so it's okay to, you know, you just be careful of your body cam, that's all.

00:48:01.929 --> 00:48:15.130
And I think, and I really think that sometimes like the whole ball busting that goes on um in uniform, whether it's military or it's law enforcement, I mean, we learn to laugh at each other and all of our deficiencies.

00:48:15.449 --> 00:48:17.049
And it's a good thing.

00:48:17.210 --> 00:48:18.009
Like, I don't care.

00:48:18.170 --> 00:48:27.610
Like I'm I'm to a point in my life where like you, I've always told people before, you can say whatever you want to me, because I've probably already said it to myself in a mirror sometime.

00:48:27.769 --> 00:48:30.009
Like, you know, whatever it is, right?

00:48:30.170 --> 00:48:32.329
So um, but that's just how you gotta be.

00:48:32.409 --> 00:48:39.690
You gotta develop that thick skin and you gotta be able to be cool under the collar and and under pressure, under the stress and anxiety, like I mentioned before.

00:48:39.849 --> 00:48:45.529
And yeah, um, you talked about earlier, um, you mentioned something about tribe.

00:48:45.769 --> 00:48:53.130
And speaking of tribe, I've been doing Brazilian Jiu Jitsu for more years than I than I would like to admit because I'm only a brown belt.

00:48:53.529 --> 00:49:06.730
Um, but I've been doing uh Brazilian Jiu Tsu for a number of years, and I've been so fortunate and so blessed to have found a tribe of people that I've trained with over the years, and you show up to fitness events and BJJ seminars as well.

00:49:06.969 --> 00:49:07.449
Yes, yes.

00:49:07.690 --> 00:49:09.849
Um, why are those environments important?

00:49:10.570 --> 00:49:12.170
Uh oh, it's just the camaraderie.

00:49:12.250 --> 00:49:13.929
It's beautiful to see you guys together.

00:49:14.090 --> 00:49:20.489
I can, you know, there's one thing for us to kind of come in from the outside and help, but it's it's amazing to see you guys together.

00:49:20.650 --> 00:49:36.889
And then um to see specific law enforcement seminars, to see these like act tactics that can actually save your life and get you guys home to de-escalate situations and make uh arrests that are safe is is just a very cool thing to see.

00:49:37.049 --> 00:49:41.369
And it's just nice to just I have everybody together.

00:49:41.449 --> 00:49:44.889
It's just a very specific and very special community and camaraderie.

00:49:44.969 --> 00:49:49.289
And it doesn't matter the skill level, and it doesn't matter if you've never done it before.

00:49:49.449 --> 00:50:02.170
Um, every organization that I've worked with where I've been fortunate enough to attend, they it's just everyone is is it's just a brotherhood and a sisterhood because there's a lot of uh women that do it too and are amazing at it.

00:50:02.409 --> 00:50:04.009
So it's an incredible community.

00:50:04.090 --> 00:50:16.809
And I actually have um I think I have like two or three of those events coming up in the next couple of months, and then a um a fitness event in May for Reps for Responders.

00:50:17.049 --> 00:50:25.130
So it's it's a pretty cool combination of, you know, fitness and and getting people together to w talk about mental health.

00:50:25.610 --> 00:50:26.889
I can't really explain it.

00:50:27.049 --> 00:50:39.690
I don't know what it is, but for some reason I have a deep respect and a deep friendship with people who have kicked my ass and over the years, or I've kicked their ass.

00:50:39.929 --> 00:50:50.809
Because I've been I mean, there's guys that I'm still friends with today that have we've been together for almost 20 years, just no matter if we live you know hundreds of miles apart.

00:50:50.969 --> 00:50:58.969
And I was so blessed last week um that my buddy Damien Tannenbaum, shout out to Damien, he is a Brazilian Jitsu black belt.

00:50:59.049 --> 00:51:02.969
But when we were young budding bluebelts, we used to just beat the shit out of each other.

00:51:03.130 --> 00:51:07.529
And to this day, when we get together, it's just like, bro, what's up, man?

00:51:07.610 --> 00:51:10.009
It's been like 15 years since I've seen you.

00:51:10.170 --> 00:51:13.769
And like my other buddy Chris McMahon, uh, he's also a black belt.

00:51:13.849 --> 00:51:17.210
All my friends are black belts except for me, because of whatever, right?

00:51:17.369 --> 00:51:22.009
So um my training has been on and off, and I really haven't cared about belts all that much.

00:51:22.170 --> 00:51:43.130
But um, with that being said, it's just been such a like you mentioned, camaraderie between myself and other people in this environment where our egos are outside of the door, and we're just there and we're beating each other up, and then we're shaking hands afterwards, and it it it just creates that that great relationship with people.

00:51:43.289 --> 00:51:48.650
Do you think that responders open up more in a physical training environment than 100%?

00:51:49.049 --> 00:51:49.289
Yes.

00:51:49.449 --> 00:51:49.690
Yeah.

00:51:50.009 --> 00:51:50.489
100%.

00:51:50.889 --> 00:51:54.090
There's something about it that's just brings people together.

00:51:54.250 --> 00:52:11.769
And um I work closely with um an organization, BJJ Cops, and Brennan de Alavera is a Florida police officer who runs it, and he does uh specific law enforcement uh jujitsu and then also like vehicle extraction type tactics and things like that.

00:52:11.929 --> 00:52:16.170
So everyone brings their their vests or their belts for part of it as well.

00:52:16.570 --> 00:52:19.130
Um and just generally who is that again?

00:52:19.289 --> 00:52:20.969
His name's Brennan de Oliveira.

00:52:21.289 --> 00:52:22.969
I can send you his uh his page.

00:52:23.210 --> 00:52:31.049
Yeah, but um but yeah, I just see them coming together, the officers, and just everyone's meeting each other.

00:52:31.210 --> 00:52:32.329
What agency are you from?

00:52:32.489 --> 00:52:33.849
You know, what do you do?

00:52:34.009 --> 00:52:38.570
What, you know, um, what specific, you know, unit are you on, things like that.

00:52:38.809 --> 00:52:40.570
And everyone's there for the same reason.

00:52:40.730 --> 00:52:42.170
So there is a camaraderie to it.

00:52:42.250 --> 00:52:50.489
And it's also nice for cops to be able to, you know, physically, yes, physical health is so important for, you know, for mental health.

00:52:50.570 --> 00:52:51.449
It's all connected.

00:52:51.610 --> 00:52:53.690
Being active, being in shape.

00:52:53.849 --> 00:52:55.369
I mean, these are life-saving things.

00:52:55.449 --> 00:53:04.489
And then having the jujitsu skills when it comes to um on scene and arrests and and things like that, it's just it's just a win-win all around.

00:53:04.650 --> 00:53:10.730
But also it's just very, very good for um discipline as well and mental health and things like that.

00:53:10.889 --> 00:53:21.610
So it's all that's something that I do cover like with clients in general, is not just therapy, but it's also fitness, nutrition, wellness, hydration, sleep, all of those pieces.

00:53:22.009 --> 00:53:30.409
So uh yeah, definitely physical stuff is is great and it really does bring people together and nobody's judging on anybody's level, which is nice.

00:53:30.489 --> 00:53:32.730
It's like you just do what you can do and that's it.

00:53:33.130 --> 00:53:34.170
And everybody's cool.

00:53:34.329 --> 00:53:43.130
You know, the best thing about training is that I always tell people this like if I'm here with my physical training and you're here, I can always come down to here.

00:53:43.289 --> 00:53:50.650
But like if I'm trying to bump up, that's where bad decisions happen, that's when injuries happen and things like that.

00:53:50.809 --> 00:53:54.250
So a lot of us can kind of bump down to each other's.

00:53:54.329 --> 00:54:13.449
And I've it's weird because I was just at a conference in Vegas and I was talking to um a buddy and I, a buddy of mine, BJ Baldwin, and we were talking about that, about how when you're grappling with someone or you're rolling with someone, you can feel the the level and you can bump it down or bump it up.

00:54:13.610 --> 00:54:17.289
And uh the all that shit translates to real life at the end of the day.

00:54:17.369 --> 00:54:23.529
If you're dealing with a subject and you need to be lighter on them, you're better to be trained than untrained.

00:54:23.849 --> 00:54:28.969
So all this stuff is is very, very pertinent to the job.

00:54:29.130 --> 00:54:34.250
Um, from what you've seen, how does jujitsu intersect with emotional resilience?

00:54:34.650 --> 00:54:42.250
Um it's a discipline that just crosses so many uh different concepts of a person.

00:54:42.409 --> 00:54:48.170
So when it comes to mental, I mean, just being just being fit, right?

00:54:48.250 --> 00:54:56.570
And being being trained, um, it automatically changes your presence and your command, which automatically makes you feel better.

00:54:56.730 --> 00:55:00.090
You feel more comfortable in yourself and you feel more confident.

00:55:00.329 --> 00:55:02.329
Um, it also gets stress out.

00:55:02.409 --> 00:55:05.289
I mean, physical stress physically builds up in our bodies.

00:55:05.529 --> 00:55:13.130
So having physical activity gets stress out, which makes someone a lot more emotionally strong because they're not carrying it all around.

00:55:13.289 --> 00:55:16.650
Um, and also, you know, I can't say enough about the camaraderie.

00:55:16.730 --> 00:55:30.969
I see it every time I go to these events of people just coming together and honestly being around people like that who are disciplined, who are gonna push you to be better, who are gonna encourage you, um, who are gonna include you right away.

00:55:31.289 --> 00:55:35.369
Those are huge, huge important factors for mental health.

00:55:35.529 --> 00:55:36.889
It is the coolest thing to see.

00:55:36.969 --> 00:55:44.730
And I'm just sitting there at my table watching, and I'm just like, I love it because I'm just like seeing people who've never met each other just connect.

00:55:44.809 --> 00:55:58.170
And not just as cops, you know, talking about their lives and talking about, you know, what they do and if they train for this or they do this or what, you know, it's it's uh, you know, I think emotionally it just makes people stronger because it there's more of a bond.

00:55:59.049 --> 00:55:59.369
Yeah.

00:55:59.610 --> 00:56:01.610
No, I 100% agree.

00:56:01.849 --> 00:56:11.369
Um, I run into uh Brazilian jujitsu practitioners um and hobbyists uh in uniform all the time, and it's like, where have you trained at?

00:56:11.449 --> 00:56:15.449
And all the, you know, it's just a cool conversation, cool icebreaker to have with people.

00:56:15.690 --> 00:56:22.409
But you're right about the confidence part because like you can tell by the way somebody walks and talks, like whether or not they've trained before.

00:56:22.730 --> 00:56:27.130
And it's just something that that you see and it's highly respected in the community.

00:56:27.449 --> 00:56:32.889
What happens when trauma, which is what we're talking about, goes untreated for years?

00:56:33.210 --> 00:56:34.969
It can have some of the hard truths.

00:56:35.610 --> 00:56:37.849
Yeah, it can have a lot of damage.

00:56:37.929 --> 00:56:39.929
It does have a lot of collateral damage.

00:56:40.009 --> 00:56:52.809
It can damage relationships, it can damage um, you know, whether it's it's you know, marriages or children or families, uh, it can lead to unhealthy coping mechanisms, substance abuse, addiction.

00:56:53.130 --> 00:57:02.809
Um, you know, people suppress it or they want to, you know, push it away or compartmentalize and pretend it's not there, or I can just get over it by myself.

00:57:03.049 --> 00:57:06.889
Um, it can just manifest in so many unhealthy ways.

00:57:07.049 --> 00:57:09.610
And it's not that you have to go through every single trauma.

00:57:09.690 --> 00:57:12.650
Like I'm very careful when I have um clients with trauma.

00:57:12.730 --> 00:57:14.650
I'm like, you don't have to go through every detail.

00:57:14.809 --> 00:57:26.409
I don't want to re-traumatize you, but we can talk about what you're feeling or how we're dealing with it, and we can look at it in a different light or just understand that this is not your fault.

00:57:26.570 --> 00:57:29.049
That's a huge piece of it, too, is it's not your fault.

00:57:29.210 --> 00:57:31.769
If you have trauma, it's not your fault.

00:57:31.929 --> 00:57:34.650
And and the the effects of it are not your fault.

00:57:34.730 --> 00:57:40.650
But it is something that can um we can work on healing, but healing is is a journey, it's not a destination.

00:57:40.809 --> 00:57:43.049
So it's not like, all right, you're healed, let's go.

00:57:43.210 --> 00:57:50.570
It's just um, you know, what knowing that you you can get better and you can uh feel better.

00:57:50.730 --> 00:57:59.610
But if you let it build up and build up, it can definitely manifest into a lot of negative ways and it can spread out into your life in a lot of other negative ways as well.

00:58:00.009 --> 00:58:00.650
Yeah.

00:58:01.049 --> 00:58:05.690
Becky, is it weird that I hate talking about mental health, but I think it's necessary.

00:58:06.409 --> 00:58:08.250
Both can be true at once.

00:58:08.570 --> 00:58:21.130
I mean, honestly, it's not something that I had planned on tackling running this podcast, but I understand the net the necessity of having these conversations.

00:58:21.289 --> 00:58:33.849
I understand the necessity of people like you existing um to help save others, and I am highly appreciative of the support that folks like you provide our community because we definitely need it.

00:58:33.929 --> 00:58:34.250
All right.

00:58:34.329 --> 00:58:52.889
There's enough haters out there, enough naysayers, enough, you know, don't beat your wife, you know, commenters out there who don't truly have any empathy at all, don't care about um the the men and women who who wear the uniform and truly want to go out there and make a positive difference in the world.

00:58:53.130 --> 00:59:00.730
If any veteran or officer out there is listening right now and is and is saying, I'm fine, what would you challenge them with?

00:59:01.130 --> 00:59:08.170
They I would say just understand that it's okay to ask for help and and that you might be fine right now, and that's okay.

00:59:08.489 --> 00:59:15.849
But if you're ever not fine or you feel like there's something that you feel like you want to talk about, there are those of us who will listen.

00:59:16.090 --> 00:59:24.650
Um, you know, and especially, you know, like I mentioned before for men, um it's really hard sometimes for men to ask for help.

00:59:24.809 --> 00:59:37.610
It's it's men are supposed to be strong and supposed to be the provider and supposed to be the leader and supposed to be everything, and there's so much pressure that, you know, it is okay to feel that way as a man.

00:59:37.769 --> 00:59:44.570
It doesn't make you any less of a man or less of a leader or less of a good husband or a good father or whatever the case may be.

00:59:44.809 --> 00:59:48.170
Um you don't have to go through it alone, and it's not weakness.

00:59:48.250 --> 00:59:52.570
It's just sometimes we just have a lot in our heads and we just need to organize it.

00:59:52.730 --> 00:59:58.809
You know, the chaos, the chaos and the the darkness and all these different things can get all murky and messed up in our heads.

00:59:58.969 --> 01:00:03.210
So it's kind of just getting it out and then categorizing it sometimes.

01:00:03.449 --> 01:00:06.489
Um, but yeah, I mean, we get that I'm fine all the time.

01:00:06.570 --> 01:00:12.409
I use it myself sometimes too, you know, and it's not so fine, but it's just like, yeah, yeah, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'll feel I'll figure it out.

01:00:12.570 --> 01:00:15.289
Um, but just ask yourself, am I, am I fine?

01:00:15.449 --> 01:00:29.610
And don't look for problems where there are none, but also be open to the fact that if there is, you know, you're willing to talk to somebody and just kind of um, you know, be vulnerable, but you don't have to talk about anything you don't want to talk about.

01:00:29.769 --> 01:00:38.730
You need to find someone who will tailor their therapy or their counseling to you instead of you fitting into some sort of cookie cutter.

01:00:39.610 --> 01:00:40.570
Amen to that.

01:00:40.809 --> 01:00:44.170
I've walked out of a few uh therapists' offices myself.

01:00:44.329 --> 01:00:45.289
I could say that right now.

01:00:45.369 --> 01:00:48.570
Like, all right, I've I've said, look, this isn't gonna work out.

01:00:48.730 --> 01:00:53.210
Just whatever this is, chemistry, personality, character, whatever, this isn't gonna work out.

01:00:53.449 --> 01:00:56.489
So respectfully, I'm gonna go find something else.

01:00:56.650 --> 01:00:58.409
And there's nothing wrong with that, 100%.

01:00:58.809 --> 01:01:05.130
I'm glad you mentioned that because not every it's just like teachers, it's just like any other profession in the world.

01:01:05.210 --> 01:01:06.170
It's just like doctors.

01:01:06.329 --> 01:01:10.489
Like, not everybody is gonna be your cup of tea and you're not gonna be their cup of tea.

01:01:10.570 --> 01:01:12.809
So maybe go find that right fit somewhere else.

01:01:13.130 --> 01:01:13.529
Exactly.

01:01:13.690 --> 01:01:14.650
And it's not personal.

01:01:14.809 --> 01:01:18.809
It's personal for the client because they need help, but it's not personal for me.

01:01:18.969 --> 01:01:22.889
If someone comes and sees me and is like, you know, I'm I don't really think this is the right fit, okay.

01:01:22.969 --> 01:01:29.769
Let me I can try to help you find somebody else, or I can wish you well and let you know that if you ever want to come back, I'm here, that type of thing.

01:01:30.090 --> 01:01:32.009
But you know, yeah.

01:01:32.570 --> 01:01:39.610
Becky, from what you've seen, your experiences, what does strength truly look like in today's first responder and military culture?

01:01:40.009 --> 01:01:46.409
Strength is being able to be vulnerable, honestly.

01:01:46.730 --> 01:01:48.889
Strength is, I mean, strength is strength, right?

01:01:48.969 --> 01:01:54.489
But it's also being able to be like, you know, I I I think I do need some help or I do need to talk to somebody.

01:01:54.650 --> 01:01:57.529
Um, because asking for help is not a sign of weakness.

01:01:57.610 --> 01:01:58.809
It's it is a sign of strength.

01:01:58.969 --> 01:02:00.170
Trying to do it all on your own.

01:02:00.250 --> 01:02:02.409
We're not supposed to as human beings.

01:02:02.809 --> 01:02:09.529
Um so strength is really admitting, like, hey, I I do need help or I do need support.

01:02:09.769 --> 01:02:14.809
Um and and being able to be honest with yourself because then it makes you stronger.

01:02:14.969 --> 01:02:21.449
Like a lot of times, you know, you can feel weak, but it doesn't mean you are weak, right?

01:02:21.529 --> 01:02:29.130
So you can be a strong person, but you can have vulnerable and weak moments, but that doesn't make you weak.

01:02:30.170 --> 01:02:37.929
And when you do ask for help, that actually makes you stronger and builds up resilience because it's hard for some people to ask for help.

01:02:38.009 --> 01:02:41.369
So if you ask for help, that was a hard thing.

01:02:41.529 --> 01:02:43.289
You've already done hard things before.

01:02:43.369 --> 01:02:47.049
So now you can do even harder things because you know you've done it already.

01:02:47.130 --> 01:02:49.690
And that's where the strength and resilience comes in.

01:02:49.929 --> 01:02:59.769
So it's sort of flipping the script and being like, all right, asking for help is actually strength because I'm gonna learn some tools to be able to deal with this and I'm gonna be that much stronger.

01:02:59.849 --> 01:03:04.730
My armor is gonna be that much tougher because I know now what to do.

01:03:04.889 --> 01:03:12.090
So it's basically just kind of adding to, you know, for like a weapon metaphor, adding to your armory, right?

01:03:12.250 --> 01:03:13.449
I just need to have these tools.

01:03:13.529 --> 01:03:17.690
So when this stuff comes at me, now I know what to do, and now I'm more resilient.

01:03:17.769 --> 01:03:22.170
And that's where the resilience comes from is is that vulnerability.

01:03:22.730 --> 01:03:36.090
Yeah, process and perspective are two big things, in my opinion, that has helped me over the years with, I guess, just getting through mental concepts and bad times, basically.

01:03:36.329 --> 01:03:37.929
And today is an interesting day for me.

01:03:38.009 --> 01:03:43.690
I had an uncle that had a massive stroke uh this morning, and then I've been at the hospital all day, and thankfully he got through a surgery.

01:03:43.769 --> 01:03:59.130
And so it having this conversation with you uh about mental health and you know being mentally strong, but also being vulnerable at the same time, being honest with yourself has been quite a refreshing conversation.

01:03:59.289 --> 01:04:01.130
It's been a great conversation so far.

01:04:01.369 --> 01:04:04.889
Is there anything that I didn't mention during this podcast that you want to mention?

01:04:05.289 --> 01:04:11.529
No, I I think it's great to um I love that you said you hate talking about it, but you're talking about it anyway.

01:04:11.690 --> 01:04:14.969
You know, I think that's I think that's honest, and I think that both can be true at once.

01:04:15.049 --> 01:04:21.210
And that's the other thing, too, is a lot of things, both a lot of things can exist simultaneously, you know.

01:04:21.369 --> 01:04:27.369
Um, but I think that even makes it even more authentic that it's just like, all right, we got it, we have to.

01:04:27.449 --> 01:04:29.449
Like there's just some stuff we have to do.

01:04:29.690 --> 01:04:38.730
And if it helps even one person, um, you know, and I, you know, I I don't save anyone, I try to help people save themselves.

01:04:38.969 --> 01:04:44.489
Um, any progress people make is usually is not in the sessions, it's in between the sessions.

01:04:44.730 --> 01:04:51.529
So when my clients do the work, they get the credit um and the progress they make, and we make sure we go through those wins.

01:04:51.610 --> 01:04:57.849
And sometimes people don't always see the progress they're making because they're they're so focused on the end game.

01:04:57.929 --> 01:05:02.329
And it's like, no, we've got to count every single little win here because they all matter.

01:05:02.489 --> 01:05:04.969
Even just booking an appointment and showing up for your appointment.

01:05:05.049 --> 01:05:07.049
I'm like, hi, that's those are wins.

01:05:07.369 --> 01:05:13.690
Because there are plenty of people who don't book the appointment or do book and don't show up, or show up and don't want to do the work.

01:05:13.849 --> 01:05:22.730
So, you know, I help them kind of build a foundation, and then we build on it from there to create progress.

01:05:23.210 --> 01:05:27.449
Um, so I appreciate the fact that you're willing to talk about it.

01:05:27.769 --> 01:05:32.730
Yeah, and I was just talking from my heart.

01:05:32.889 --> 01:05:42.170
Like honestly, I would love to talk about like kick-ass stuff and whatever and not talk about this lovey-dovey like mental health stuff.

01:05:42.409 --> 01:05:47.929
But like I said, I understand, I understand the importance of it and the necessity of it.

01:05:48.090 --> 01:06:09.130
Uh, when I run into someone that has passion and expertise, such as yourself, I gotta, I gotta have this conversation because um as a leader myself, um it's important for me to put this out into the universe um and to also be part of your journey as well to help people get notified about who you are and what you're doing, Becky.

01:06:09.289 --> 01:06:13.289
Um, if people want to follow you on social media, what platforms are you on?

01:06:13.769 --> 01:06:16.570
Um I am on Instagram and Facebook.

01:06:16.730 --> 01:06:20.329
So it's at holding space for heroes on both.

01:06:20.730 --> 01:06:21.049
Okay.

01:06:21.529 --> 01:06:26.570
So yeah, at holding space on Instagram and at holding space on Facebook.

01:06:26.809 --> 01:06:32.250
Um Yeah, so folks out there, make sure you follow Becky on both those platforms.

01:06:32.329 --> 01:06:38.250
I'll try to remember to put that at the bottom in the show notes um and the description of the YouTube as well.

01:06:38.489 --> 01:06:41.369
Becky, I truly appreciate what you're doing.

01:06:41.929 --> 01:06:45.610
You you didn't just talk about supporting this community.

01:06:45.769 --> 01:06:53.529
You showed up, you built trust over time, and you chose to equip yours equipped yourself professionally to serve at a much deeper level.

01:06:53.610 --> 01:06:56.570
And I appreciate you taking this two to three tier.

01:06:57.130 --> 01:07:00.250
Deep with me today in this podcast and having this conversation.

01:07:00.570 --> 01:07:06.250
Formation Nation, here's a takeaway: mental readiness is tactical readiness.

01:07:06.409 --> 01:07:11.449
You can train your body, you can sharpen your skills, you can stay operationally prepared.

01:07:11.610 --> 01:07:27.289
But if you don't process what you've seen, what you've carried, and what you've suppressed, it will surface sometime, somewhere, whether in your sleep, in your leadership, in your marriage, in your health, proactive wellness, it's not weakness, it's leadership.

01:07:27.449 --> 01:07:28.730
And that's what we've learned today.

01:07:28.809 --> 01:07:34.650
And if something in this conversation resonates with you, take the first step, reach out, have the conversation.

01:07:34.809 --> 01:07:42.009
I'll have Becky's information in the show notes and the show description as well, including holding spaces for heroes.

01:07:42.170 --> 01:07:45.130
Um until next time, folks, Becky, thank you so much.

01:07:45.210 --> 01:07:46.409
I really appreciate you.

01:07:46.570 --> 01:07:50.170
Um looking forward to looking forward to working with you in the future even more.

01:07:50.409 --> 01:07:51.529
Yeah, for sure.

01:07:51.690 --> 01:07:52.329
Thank you.

01:07:52.570 --> 01:07:59.130
Until next time, everyone, as always, I want you to stay tuned, stay focused, and stay motivated.

01:07:59.449 --> 01:08:01.049
Warriors, fall out.